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Year VII: Deathly Hallows Discuss, Dementors & Infiri at Books: The Restricted Section of the Library forum
What is a dementor, what do they do, what can they do...? And while I'm at it, what can ...

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Old 08-12-2006, 05:49 PM
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What is a dementor, what do they do, what can they do...?
And while I'm at it, what can the Infiri do, what are their limits...?

This discussion began in "Shacklebolt" (fan fiction)
then drifted around the accidental horcrux idea,
and it's not really fan fiction any more.

Quote:
"Bob" and the Accidental Horcrux:

...Remember Aunt Marge -- accidents can happen when one is upset, angry or frightened. Harry was not in control.

When Voldemort arrived at Godric's Hollow, he was prepared to create a horcrux. Whatever he needed -- materials, equipment, intention, mindset, prior meditation -- whatever it takes, he had it with him at that moment. He was good to go. His intended victim (the fresh kill that a horcrux seems to require) was Harry. The intended recepticle for the horcrux we do not know.

When Voldemort's spell backfired, he was ripped from his body and he was not in control. Stuff happens. The "fresh kill" ended up being Lily and/or James, and the recepticle for the shard of Voldemort's soul ended up being Harry.

For lack of a better one, I have given the name, “Bob” to the individual dementor who attacked Harry when he had been instructed to look for Sirius. Because Harry is an accidental horcrux, he somehow stands out to them. They can probably sense in Harry the evil shard of Voldemort's soul. Dementors are blind. They were instructed to look for a murderer. "Bob" was just following instructions, bypassing the innocent soul and attacking the evil one.

Cornelius Fudge understands and is able to talk to the dementors. They told him that Sirius had been "talking in his sleep," and they were angrier than he had ever seem them. Do dementors have individual names? As his former employer, would Fudge recognize the name of "Bob?"

If asked, can "Bob" explain his actions on that day by the lake?

A "dementor's kiss" removes the soul while leaving the person technically alive. Can "Bob" provide treatment? Can he remove the shard without harming Harry? Some of the horcruxes might be cursed or have special protections added after the fact. This shard will not.

===========================

Voldemort probably already suspects that Harry is an accidental horcrux. This will not slow him down in his efforts to eliminate Harry -- he hates Harry more than he loves the shard. He never intended to create it in the first place.

He does not appear to think about his horcurxes often, and Dumbledore believes that he will not notice when they are destroyed. Voldemort is, however, aware of his mysterious connection to Harry. He would notice a sudden change in this connection between them. He would want to know what it means. It would frighten him, more than anything about Harry has frightened him to date.

Seeking "treatment" too early in the game would give Voldemort a clue that we do not want him to have.[/b]
Quote:
One problem- you're humanising dementors too much.

"Dementors are among the foulest creatures that walk this earth. They infest the darkest, filthiest places, they glory in decay and despair, they drain peace, hope, and happiness out of the air around them. Even Muggles feel their presence, though they can't see them. Get too near a Dementor and every good feeling, every happy memory will be sucked out of you. If it can, the Dementor will feed on you long enough to reduce you to something like itself...soul-less and evil. You will be left with nothing but the worst experiences of your life."

I'm pretty sure dementors don't have mothers, but didn't it say in the sixth book about the green mist being caused by dementors breeding?

Heres a thought- Dementors are created by the veil in the Department of Mysteries. Whoever goes through it becomes a dementor. But then Sirius...eek! I don't know...doesn't seem very likely. [/b]
"Humanising dementors?" You're right, of course. The point was to think about them again. They are intelligent (creatures? entities?) who can hear our language and communicate, feel anger, follow instructions, form alliances with one group of humans against another... Making them lovable might be pushing it, but they can be helpful.

I get the feeling Sirius is simply dead & gone. No clues, no ambiguity... he just died.


Quote:
Where do dementors live? I don't think they would live anywhere. Maybe they just glide around all the time.

It wouldn't be Sirius back again...it would be a dementor. I don't think dementors would have personalities or likenesses to the person they once were. They would just become almost identical to every other dementor, animal like.

They remind me a bit of inferi. They were once people, living, feeling, loving, believing individuals, but now they are just...dead and puppets.

Excpet we know dementors get angry and excited, but I think it's would be like when Tom Riddle was happy, how he became animal like, a wild sort of inhuman happiness.

What I'm trying to say is...I think dementors are vaguely human like, but much more crude. [/b]
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Old 08-12-2006, 05:49 PM
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Old 08-12-2006, 05:59 PM
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A "gingerbread children" ending would use a devise that allows a lot of people to come back when we thought they were dead. A feel-good ending with weak logic.

Bringing a bunch of beloved characters back as Inferi or dementors is kind-of the opposite. and no better. Gingerbread Monsters? I think the logic is similar, but it wouldn't make a very happy ending.

Also, I can't imagine the Ministry of Magic doing something like that on a massive scale. Maybe someone evil could build a copy of the arch/dias/vail. But dementors are probably not any easier to control than humans.

People becoming dementors? That sounds like the Lord of the rings. Those bad guys on black horses -- what were they called? They were once greedy kings who sold their souls...

Did JKR invent dementors and Inferi?
Does something like them exist in legend or literature?
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Old 08-12-2006, 10:12 PM
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I'm glad you started this topic, Psyduck.

Dementors:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dementors

Inferi:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inferi

There's some good stuff in these sites.

Dementors aren't easy to control. Remember how they came to the quidditch match. And how they have turned away from the Ministry.

Quote:
Bringing a bunch of beloved characters back as Inferi or dementors is kind-of the opposite. and no better. Gingerbread Monsters? I think the logic is similar, but it wouldn't make a very happy ending. [/b]
It wouldn't be bringing them back. Inferi are dead bodies. They are just like puppets. They have no life. Imagine if in the 7th book Harry or someone is attacked by a bunch of inferi and he sees the bodies of people he knows!! Sure wouldn't be a happy ending.

And I reckon if dementors were created by the veil, Harry would find out that the veil creates them and he would realise that Sirius is a dementor. He'd be wondering which dementor Sirius is. But Sirius wouldn't be Sirius anymore. He'd be a dementor.
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Old 08-13-2006, 04:34 AM
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quote]Imagine if in the 7th book Harry or someone is attacked by a bunch of inferi and he sees the bodies of people he knows!![/quote]

Would be even sadder if those inferi bodies were those of his parents.[
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Old 08-14-2006, 12:14 AM
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Quote:
People becoming dementors? That sounds like the Lord of the rings. Those bad guys on black horses -- what were they called? They were once greedy kings who sold their souls...

Did JKR invent dementors and Inferi?
Does something like them exist in legend or literature?
[/b]
What you are referring to from Lord of the Rings are the Nazgul or Ringwraiths. They don't suck happiness like the Dementors do (not that directly at least) but both JKR and Alfonso Cuarón borrowed heavily from Tolkien's Ringwraiths when creating the dementors. In fact, ringwraiths are the first thing I thought of when I first read/saw the dementors.
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Old 08-14-2006, 01:55 AM
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I never saw a serious connection before between a Ringwrath and a dementor. Lots of bad guys wear black hoods and cloaks. Starting with the Grim Reeper.
The link above says that dementors were inspired by nightmares J.K. Rowling had as a teenager.

Lupin believes he know something and is sure that Sirius is dead.

I still can't see the Ministry keeping such a dangerous toy around and knowingly creating dementors.
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