But Wait! Theres More! Clues, That Is.

When Harry, in the cave, is making Dumbledore drink that potion he was -Hating himself, repulsed by what he was doing, Harry forced the goblet back toward Dumbledore's mouth ...(HBP pg 571/534)

Now, notice any similarities to this?

Snape gazed for a moment at Dumbledore, and there was revulsion and hatred etched in the harsh lines of his face. "Severus... Please..." (HBP pg 595/556)

Revulsion and Hatred. Both Snape and Harry hated what they were doing. I already supected that, but it's interesting to note that JK used almost exactly the same wording to hint at this.


Also, at Dumbledores funeral, the body burst into flames.

Remember in PoA when Harry was doing his homework, he had to read about Medieval Witch Burnings?

Non-magic people (more commonly known as muggles) were particularly afraid of magic in medieval times, but not very good at recognizing it. On the rare occasion that they did catch a real witch or wizard, burning had no effect whatsoever. The witch or wizard would perform a basic Flame Freezing Charm and then pretend to shriek with pain while enjoying a gentle, tickling sensation. (PoA pg 2/7)

I don't think I need to explain any further.

Another good one.

Someone has mentioned that on this board before -- the revulsion and hatred...on his face.

But I hadn't thought of that reading about Medieval Witch Burnings.
Now we need to work that in, too, with the phoenix angle and everything else.
What IS that old buzzard up to?

I wish Rowling would just give us that last book already. This is killing me.

I agree with you on the just giving us the last book so we can find out what is truely going on in Harry's world. I hate the idea of waiting for so long to get the next book.

I hadn't thought about the Medieval Witch Burnings either. That is a interesting point that I haven't seen yet.

wow i never thought of any of those....those r good 1's!

Also, Fawkes was close by on the night of Dumbledores death, We know that because he was singing.

So why didn't he help Dumbledore?

Fawkes has stepped in (or should I say flew in) just in time to save the day twice (2nd Book, 5th book) so why didn't he come and help Dumbledore if he was close by?
Because Dumbledore asked him not to save him, that's why. If not, Fawkes would have saved him.
It was all planned, I tell you!

Or what if Dumbledore was only injured by the curse, not killed and Fawkes was healing him? Do Pheonix's sing while they heal?
You know in the 5th book, Harry tries to do the Cruciatous curse on Bellatrix, but it only knocks her off her feet because Harry didn't desperately want to cause pain, he wouldn't have enjoyed it. So if Snape says the curse words without meaning it would it hurt Dumbledore? Probably not. Maybe it just knocked him off his feet, over the tower wall? Fawkes would be able to heal that.

The first time I read the 'Dumby dies' scene I ran towards all those pheonix/ he isn't really dead/denial theories too but... mate.. sorry.. he is dead. Jo wouldn't mess around with death i reckon; dead is dead. You grieve for the rest of your life but you cannot bring them back. I think the whole pheonix shape rising from the pyre and the pheonix song, all the pheonix references, are more about hope rising from the ashes rather than Dumbledore rising from the ashes. Harry is hope not Dumbledore.

Good thoughts, but there is something that doesn't make sense about the whole Witch Burning thing. After the fire went out, Dumbledore's body was gone, but with the Flame Freezing Charm, there still would have been a body since they were still there to make fake shrieks of pain. Do you get what I mean?

Seriously sirius: Nice thinking on the whole Snape not being into the curse so it not working theory. But I still agree with BuffyBuff, he's dead. JK.....okay, in truth she might actually mess with death, so I'll just keep my mind open.

She's "messed with death" plenty of times before.
She'll do it again.
I believe Sirius is dead.
I won't believe that Dumbledore is dead
until the end of the last book.

I agree, Sirius is dead, even if I usually go by the 'there's no corpse then he must be alive' theory, I still believe that Sirius really is dead because of the way JK had reacted to it. And I will keep my mind open to the Dumbledore death because there are clues that go either way, you know what I mean?

psyduck; Jo's only 'messed with death' once with Peter Petigrew. That was more a diabolical plan than a real ''bring someone back from the dead thing' though, so I reckon that doesn't count. Jo's told us that the death of her mum impacted on the plot of HP almost as much as it did her life. I don't think she'll be doing a 'bring them back in the last scene for happy cuddles'. Death is death. Goodbyes are goodbyes. Living with out them is a struggle. Anything else is a cop out.

GinWeasRoc: As said before, I was swayed by the 'Dumby's not dead' thread for a while but for all the reasons aboce and cannon proof, i reckon he's a gonna. Why do you think he might still be alive?