If Tom Riddle Had Won ... ?

A memory can come to life. That's what was happening in the Chamber, as ginny died, Tom was becoming real/ solid/ alive. I wonder if tom would have got on with Voldemort? They might be the same person but there's a 50 year age gap..??

I just don't see how we can resolve this 'Can Harry kill Voldemort and can Voldemort kill harry?' thing. Voldemort can't be killed, he's done everything to make himself immortal and they all seem to be working pretty well. Voldemort can't kill harry because of the protection charm and the connection between them AND because he has tried and, IT JUST DOSEN"T WORK!!!...???? My head hurts.

Anyway back to the topic: Why would Voldemort be stronger if Tom had survived?
I don't see how having two commanders/ Voldemorts, would make him more powerful. It would just confuse the deatheaters. Therefore:
Something Tom knows that Voldemort doesn't...??? What???
Could the tom/memory communicate with Voldemort?? I don't think so. Tom found out what Voldemort had done through Ginny. He didn't know anything about himself after he was 'put' into the diary.

"Scar" is the last word of the 6th so we're told. I reckon this is 'cause the scar rpresents the connectiion between Harry and Voldemort and figuring THAT out has gotta be the next two books. Primarily, figuring out can they kill each other...???

Personally, I don't think that the "scar" thing really helps anything. I think she was just trying to destract from everything else.

What I meant with the memory thing, was that Harry stabbed the diary with the tooth, which was the memory, so that memory no longer exists, right? If he HAD come back to life, I think that there would be some sort of spell to combine the people, or Voldemort would've gotten info from him, and then put him as an undercover person or something.

Okay, I think that since there is no way for Harry and Voldemort to live together, something has to die. As we know, Harry survived the curse, so maybe Voldemort could do the opposite - die under protection. As we can tell, anything is possible.

Also, maybe it's that they both have to die in order for others to live.

Rita: Sorry. I gotta disagree with you there. The scar is everything! It is not just the symbol for why Harry is HP ('The Boy Who Lived') it is also the very real and 'now', connection between Voldemort and Harry (Harry's dreams and visions.. AND 'a "murderer or a victim" prophecy'). The scar is everything about the story and Harry! It represents and IS everything that he is, everything he has been through AND WILL BE!! I don't see that there is anything else important except the scar; anything important except Harry and Voldemort's 'relationship', 'connection' ... scarring ???

Tom Riddle says that he had been sapping Ginny's life from her everytime she wrote to him. As she lay dying, Tom Riddle was becoming REAL. If Ginny had died Tom would have become as real as you or I. Once something's real, it's real. I don't see how Voldemort was going to assume/ consume Tom into him. I really don't see why he'd want to! If magicals could go around absorbing other people to become them and extract info. from them , the Deatheaters would have done it. No, Tom Riddle was Tom Riddle, not Voldemort. There was no communication between them. If Tom had won he would have been a real life human Tom Riddle separate and as real as Voldemort, i think.

So why would Voldemort have been stronger if Tom had won...?? Maybe an additional, diabolical brains. Maybe the additional managerial capacity. Maybe 'stronger' because Tom knew something Voldemort didn't/ couldn't/ hasn't figured out ...???

Hey, here's a thing: Jo says that we'll find out more about the nature of Voldemort's birth in the next books. Wottya reckon about the idea that we find out that something awful happened to Tom's mum and Tom, so that it ... not 'justifies'... but ... we can be a smidgen more 'understanding' of Tom/ Voldemort's actions... ??? We see Voldemort's emotion scar... ??? .....
YUCK!! I don't like this thought 'cause I reckon we need a villian and Voldemort's it, but i thought, I might as well put it out there while I can. What do you think?

Ohhhh!! I like the "both gotta die so EVERYONE can live" thing!! The prophecy didn't say that though. Jo's said that she wrote the prophecy "with great care... and exact wording.." so I think it says what she means it to say. It's just up to us to try to figure it out. I seriously don't think we've got much hope.

I think that this 'clue'(Ha!) is just like the 'Cedric'/ "a Main character will die" thing; we'll be looking at it in 10 years time, long after every book has been published and we've read them 50 times, and we still won't understand what she's talking about. Jo will be staring at us with that exasperated, "ohh, it's SOoo obvious!" stare. Still, fun to try to crack the code don't you reckon!?

oh BB, Please don't overthink this thing! I like your point about the true connection being the scar, but "emotional scar"? NO, no, no. I have made this point before and will again here - death does not always mean gone forever. Did you ever watch Flatliners? People are walking around all over town who've died. I still like to think Jo would want everything to work out in the end. Would I feel let down if the series ended with He-who-must-not-be-named ruling the world and Harry dead and buried? YES. Would you?

What about a time turner?

Yes, but what does the WORD scar have to do with anything? What are we going to figure out knowing its the last word? The sentence could be "and under his eye he got a scar"

Like, this could just be a distraction from something else.

OMG, yes, I would be.... omg... that would SUCK.

oh fenrirbound! Over thinking is what I do!! Sorry, I thought we'd met :P :P :P As I said above, I don't like the 'emotional scarring' thought. It was just a thought. Though, what has Tom's birth got to do with Voldemort except 'emotional scarring'?? So, I guess we might all be in for a bit of 'psychology 101' (Gawd Help Us!!) (I hope that's '101' as in beginners' class not '101' as in 'room 101' ... you know... !?... like in '1984'? ... the book? ... by... George Orwell...?... get it??) Sorry! I think I'd better do us all a favour and sleep now. Bloody 2am. AGAIN!!! I can't believe how I KEEP DOING THIS!!! FLatliner= ME!!

wow if riddle won....that would change evrything

How do you think it would have changed things slytherin4me2?

Just 'cause there would have been two of them?

Do you think Voldemort and Tom would have got on? I can see Tom saying "Don't tell me what to do!! You're not my Father!" to Voldy and Voldemort saying "Respect your elders and do what you're told and get to bed. We've got a world to conquer in the morning!" to Tom.

I don't know if they would have been SUCH a formidablre force. i don't know whether they could trust each other. What do you think?

wait wait wait i am confused i thought tom riddle was voldemort.........

slytherin4me: Yeah mate. Tom Riddle Jr and Lord Voldemort are the same person. Remember CoS was all about Tom almost coming from being a memory in a diary to being a real boy (a little Pinochio reference there) by draining the life out of Ginny? Jo was asked "what would happen if Tom Riddle had won?"/if he had succeeded in becoming a real boy, and Jo answered that Voldemort would be stronger. That's what we are discussing.

What ya reckon? Do you think they would have got on? Don't know if I would like my younger self if I got to meet her.