Character Analysis

Hi Buffybuff: You bring up an excellent point. I wondered about that too until I re-read the Prophecy.

If Dumbledore tries to kill Voldemort, Dumbledore will be unsuccessful. The Prophecy tells us so. Dumbledore on the other hand could die at the hands of Voldemort. Then who will be around to protect Harry? Dumbledore is wise enough to know that, in the magic world, you can defy the Prophecy but it will have severe consequences. That much we know.

What we don't know is if there is a Prophecy in the Department of Mysteries that pertains to Dumbledore. In any event, he is committed to Harry's life and not Voldemort's death.

What do you think?

Beautifully put Zonko. You made me reach for the prophecy again too.

Ok so "The one with the power to vanquish the Dark Lord approaches..." and then goes on to describe Harry. This implies, of course, that Harry is the ONE and the Only one who can defeat V therefore D merely tries to help out BUT does this justify D not giving it a try?? If he feels fatherly love towards Harry wouldn't you say "drats! to that mate You're going down"?

Maybe I would be sated if you explained where you got this 'the prophecy must be allowed to come true or there will be nasty consequences' thing

Gotta say, these failings of Dumbledore (who I deeply love by the way but am just trying to figure out) are pushing me towards the Gandulf/ Dumbledore analogy rather than the Alec Guiness(someone please tell me that character's name!)/ Dumbledore theory. Let's just hope Harry/Dumbledore doesn't end up being anything like a Arthur/Merlin ending.

Buffybuff: Prophecy is interesting. The question is, how self-fulfilling are all prophecies? If you know the prophecy, will you then work toward it to actually make it happen? Or is the prophecy true no matter what you do? Or will prophecy #1 be canceled out by prophecy #2? I wish I knew.

Unfortunately, the Harry Potter Books indicate that the Magical World is rather like physics. Every action has an equal and opposite reaction. So that if Dumbledore tries to kill Voldemort (contrary to the prophecy), will Voldemort move slightly because it's not his time to die and will Dumbledore's spell riccochet and hit Harry instead, killing him and thereby extinguishing the prophecy. Then the terrible result will be that Voldemort is set free to reign terror on the Magical and Muggle World.

Alec Guiness in Star Wars? Obie Won Kenobe (spell)

Cheero!

THANKYOU Zonko. Oh! be my Ken4Barbie. How could I ever forget that name!!??

I'll get back to the rest of your thought s later- must go to bed now. Why is it that I don't seem to get as much sleep since discovering this site?

Buffy: Staying awake into the wee hours is tough stuff. The spirit might be willing but the body says, "NO WAY. You did this to me last night and you're not doing this again." Get plenty of Zzzzz's, drink lots of coffee and then hit the net running. It's the only way.

Note: I think perhaps it is spelled Obie Won Kenobi. Best guess.

Plus I'm in Aus. we're about 16(?) hours ahead I think. I can tell you what the day's been like before you have to face it.

Ok so your stuff on 'p[rophecy's not in cannon?
I agree that the prophecy is the driving force of the story right now and therefore I just have to accept that fact. As far as the character analysis of Dumbledore goes, I still think it's a little weak of D to be so fatalistic about the prophecy. Then again maybe he won't; he may yet defy it by killing V himself or sacrificing himself to turn the tide of the 'inevitable'. I do agree that D is limited in defying the prophecy because: As I've quoted somewhere else (by the way is there any way to track where you've posted?) "Funny thing about magic is that there's always consequences...Always!" Spike (sigh) said that so it must be true.

Talking of weak plot bits-and picking up from something someone else said somewhere else- why hasn't Harry ever asked about his family: parents jobs, grandparents etc. I remember hearing, after the 4th, that the 5th was when H would find out more about his history. This ended up being the prophecy not family. The next books would have to fill this gapping hole surely

u dont need to call him Voldy!!!!!! it was just a joke!!!!!!!!

your best guess was right zonko....pretty sure that's it. cofffeeee gooooood....muuuuussst hhaaaavve, otherwise i look like hagrid every morning for work....talk about needing great people skills.

Wanna b: As long as you don't act like Grawp in the morning. There's an Australian movie could The Wannabes' which made me laugh if you won't to track it down.

Talking of tracking down, someone somewhere mentioned that, in the US, there are books called 'Hogwarts' written by the trio. I asked at my book store (which is closing down because Collins Books is being sold!!!!They're aren't even taking Harry's 6th ' orders!!!) and they'd never heard of them. Just an Am. thing I guess.

Did you know there are differences between the Am. and Br. publications of the books??? On JKR's site she said that the Am. version of the 1st book you meet Dean Thomas as he's being Sorted which didn't appear in the Br. Weird hey?? This might explain the length difference 'tween the US's and the Aus. editions too.

K. so I've just been seeing the sites and on the 'Leaky Culdron' (Why do I feel so at home in pubs?) they've got transcripts of interviews with JKR for various book weeks. She answers q.'s 'bout the next books. She says that there are 2 questions that we need to be asking ourselves:
1) Why didn't Dumbledore try to kill Voldemort when they were duelling in the Ministry of Magic? (Evidently he didn't give the "real reason)
2) Why didn't Voldemort die when the Advarda(sp?) curse rebounded on him?; "You should be wondering what he did to make sure that he did not die."

I think this really ties in with what we've been talking about here don't you?

So... it seems that probably/maybe, Dumbledore didn't kill Voldemort because the prophecy says that Harry has to be the murderer (I still think this is a lame excuse!!!); no-one else but Harry can kill Voldemort. BUT why is this crucial to the rest of the story?

Maybe it's not the prophecy at all?? Maybe the prophecy's only important for why Voldemort tried to kill Harry but not for why it failed? Is the prophecy the 'not real' reason D gives that JK was referring to? Is it this 'Life Debt' business that ties these two things together? I'm sure that's coming back into it when Peter Pettigrew returns so why not this as well?

*Does Dumbledore owe Voldemort a 'Life Debt'? Dumbledore can't kill Voldemort, V knows it and was just goading D when he posesses Harry's body and says "kill me now"?
*Is it that Voldemort can't kill Harry because of the same kind of thing: Voldemort owes Lily a 'Life Debt' which she passed on to her son/Harry through her sacrifice? This would explain why Voldemort didn't just kill Lily when he came in the door. When he realised what she was trying to do - protect her son- he killed her and was able to because she'd already given over the protective 'Debt'?????

What do you think?

Is this just ridiculous?

What do you make of what JKR said?